Wednesday, February 22, 2012

What Makes Ultra-Religious Jews So Racist?

One thing I always find remarkable when interacting with religious Jews is how racist they are. I don’t know which is more shocking: that a group so frequently singled out and persecuted has no problem dishing it out themselves, or that many of them don’t even see their bigoted views as racism.

While I could point out the tendency of Jews to call various outsiders by rather derogatory terms like shiksa, sheigetz, or shvartze (or other things that don’t begin with sh-), this isn’t universal… or even that big of a deal. They’re just words, and plenty of religious Jews aren’t like that, especially the younger generations.

However, a surprising amount of it apparently still runs rampant in closed Jewish communities. See, for example, this thread found by my wife on a forum of religious Jews discussing the origin of black people, and in particular the remarks made by Jude, the third comment on the page.

Individual racism of this sort aside, another thing that sets Jews apart as being so racist is their stance on “intermarriage.” If it was just Jews wanting to marry other Jews, it would be one thing (still racist, in my opinion, but not that big of a deal). However, it goes beyond one’s own personal choices in the Jewish community.

This “moral” opposition to other peoples’ intermarriage isn’t some hypothetical bigotry, it’s bigotry I have observed in every single religious Jew I ever discussed the matter with, and it is bigotry I have experienced firsthand. My wife’s parents wouldn’t meet me before our marriage, wouldn’t attend the wedding, and have only met me twice during our five year relationship… because I am not part of their race. Despite living further away, my wife has met my parents many times more than I have met hers.

It’s a common ignorance in Judaism: there is immense hostility towards Jews marrying non-Jews (coupled with a distrust of the non-religious and ethnically non-Jewish altogether). Generally, the more religious, the more hostility there seems to be. I haven’t noticed more than a “preference” for fellow Jews among the non-religious and less religious, while the more conservative/orthodox will commonly disown family not only for marrying outside of the Jewish people, but sometimes for marrying outside the very specific Jewish tradition of the family.

It’s ridiculous, really. I have seen minor pressure in other contexts. I had Mexican friends whose mothers wanted them to marry a nice Mexican girl, and the same goes for Italians and Greeks, not to mention religious Catholics and Episcopalians. I also know many people from India feel pressure from their parents to marry an Indian. Even my Catholic mom asked me once to marry a Catholic girl and get married in the Catholic Church; I never dated a Catholic again.

However, I never see the vicious consequences in these other demographics that I see among religious Jews. There might be snide remarks, but that is a far cry from being written out of the will. The only times I have seen such open hostility for intermarriage was in a few families of rural whites in Indiana, who I suspect of being KKK members. That basically puts religious Jews on par with white-supremacists in my mind. I see Jews as being akin to rednecks in kippas.

It’s blatantly inappropriate to harbor such racial intolerance in this day and age. One Jewish apologist for this practice recently commented on my blog:

“I would care if my child married a gentile because I personally believe that Judaism deserves to survive. We as a people have been through so much, and to die out due to intermarriage rather than mass-murder or Nazis would be very ironic.”

What’s ironic is that trying to encourage your children to breed only among members of a group that calls itself “God’s Chosen People” sounds eerily like a “Master Race.” This pressure to marry within one’s race is what is really ironic, given the history of Jewish oppression at the hands of Nazis, which included being legally barred from marrying non-Jews. This commenter thinks Hitler wins if Jews marry non-Jews, and yet… Hitler seems to have liked the idea of Jews sticking to their own kind… it’s a strange and backwards argument, to be sure.

When Jews marry non-Jews, Jews don’t die out, they remain genetically diverse. As it is, Jewish populations harbor a handful of unusual genetic diseases that are the result of inbreeding. It’s not like a little new blood will hurt you guys. What’s more, it’s seems very antagonistic to those of us who want to accept Jews into our culture when they are openly hostile to their children marrying us dirty, dirty gentiles.

It’s insulting, it’s rude, it’s discourteous to everyone (Jews and goy alike), and it’s downright barbaric to hold such primitive, tribal stances regarding marriage. The Jewish community ought to be ashamed on this matter. This is a shonda on you and your people. Why is this sort of behavior acceptable?

It’s the same reason for their other great race problem.

Jews had a tough run of it in WWII… and for centuries prior… and that’s putting it mildly. It’s fair to say Jews experienced some of the worst cruelty in human history during the Holocaust. No one’s questioning the reality of the suffering of millions at the hands of the Nazis.

Jews may have gotten a free pass on being a little racist given their past, and if it was just about marriage and some Yiddish slang, I might not care. But ultimately, the greatest geopolitical atrocity since WWII has been the formation and violent expansion of Israel, and Jewish racism is at the heart of this matter. With the continuous war crime that is the Nation of Israel, Jews are accruing a huge moral deficit that not even the Holocaust will be able to cover.

In very few nations is apartheid still the law of the land. No other nation has a secret nuclear weapons program that goes unchecked. But perhaps most annoying to me, all of the atrocities Israel is responsible for are funded in part by American taxpayers. I’m funding your racism, and I want it to stop.

I’m not saying this stuff to bother anyone, I’m just trying to help. If you aren’t racist, if you have no problem with Jews marrying non-Jews, and if you oppose the oppression of the Palestinian people, then please know I’m not talking about you. I don’t hold a grudge against the Jewish people. I mean, come on… you guys killed Jesus. That makes you pretty cool in my book.

And before you get all offended, I’m doing this as a favor to Jews. I spend most of my time talking about Christianity, and I figured you guys deserved some attention. I asked my wife what she thought, and she couldn’t agree more. I mean… her father bought a gun because he was worried the blacks would riot.

That said, feel free to leave any comments or e-mail me (anythingbuttheist@gmail.com), since if there’s one thing I know about religious Jews (besides how unabashedly racist so many of them are), it’s that they love to tell people when they’re offended.

128 comments:

  1. Dude, I'm definitely not arguing against the fact that a fare percentage of religious Jews are racist. What I'm curious about is this statement, "As it is, Jewish populations harbor a handful of unusual genetic diseases that are the result of inbreeding." I haven't heard of any medical issues in certain Jewish populations. Is there a link you can share?

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    1. This might be an informative link. Just as one example, my wife had to get tested for Tay-Sachs.

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    2. So you don't have to follow the link and look around, if you don't want to:

      "There are at least 19 Jewish Genetic Diseases more common in people of Ashkenazi Jewish descent and 1 in 5 Ashkenazi Jews is a carrier for at least one Jewish Genetic Disease."

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  2. You post too fast for me Brett. By the time I comment and get back to follow-up you're gone. Oh well.
    I believe saying Jews are racist is the same as saying African Americans are racist. It's true for both. Both have been the butt of racism for centuries so it's only natural that they would respond in-kind. As you said about young Jews, a few generations of acceptance and it will go away.

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    1. Sorry about how fast I post... I mean... not sorry enough to post less often, but sorry it's frustrating when trying to have a back-and-forth in a post.

      I definitely should have mentioned the pressures black people face, not sure how that slipped my mind. There is definitely pressure in the black community to marry black. I haven't personally heard of many people being outright shunned by their family for marrying someone who isn't black, but I am sure it's happened. Not sure there is an African equivalent for Israel, though.

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  3. I think you're conflating "creedism" with racism. While it's true that there are many racists among Jews, as there are among Christians, Muslims, blacks, whites, etc., the opposition to other Jews marrying non-Jews is not "racist". If the prospective non-Jewish marital candidate converted to the Jewish religion, there'd be no opposition, except among those who are truly racist. I think you're using the magic word "racist", which is clearly inapplicable in the context of Jews marrying non-Jews, just to be provocative. Unfortunately, it's also a deliberate distortion of what's going on. And, yes, there are plenty of racist Jews, as there are plenty of racists among all groups. And if a Jew opposes another Jew marrying a convert, then you'd have a genuine issue of racism.

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    1. My wife's family wouldn't accept my wife's first fiance, who was a convert, because he wasn't Jewish enough. I know that kind of thing happens, where converts are not given equal treatment as people who have generations of Jewish ancestry.

      You can reason it to yourself however you want, but to any observer not conditioned to see this as normal, it's really, really racist.

      Jews try to play both sides of this argument, sometimes claiming that "Jew" is both a religion and race, but as soon as someone calls them out on being racist, it's all about "creed." From all the evidence I have seen, it's only about "creed" when Jews are trying to argue their treatment of non-Jews isn't racism.

      Maybe the KKK doesn't hate Jews, they just hate Judaism, and if you just abandoned all of your culture, they'd accept you. That isn't racist?

      I call any practice that treats one group of people different based on their ancestry "racism," and I don't do it because it's provocative, I do it because it's true.

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    2. If they don't accept a convert, I agree with you that they're racist; however there are plenty of Jews who do indeed accept converts, so, the accusation of racism against them fails.

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    3. Why does someone have to abandon their cultural heritage to marry a Jew? Would you be okay with a Catholic demanding their child's Jewish fiance abandon Judaism?

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    4. No one "has to" abandon anything. But it is a defamatory smear to say to say that it's racist to believe that members of one's religion ought to obey their own religion that says that one must marry within the religion, when one's potential spouse in that religion can be of any race.

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    5. Right... Jews aren't racist, their religion is... got it.

      Sorry, that isn't how it works. You're trying to argue semantics, I assume because the word choice is all you can disagree with. The message is true, you just think "racist" is the wrong word for it.

      How about "Jewish Supremacy," is that fair?

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    6. You are the one who uses the inapt word "racist". Judaism recognizes Jews of any ancestry or race. Someone's race is irrelevant to his or her status as a Jew. Like many religions, adherents are distinguished from non-adherents. On your view, Christianity is "racist" because it holds that God justly eternally torments non-adherents in hell. If you're going to use the English language, use it correctly. Your faillure to use it correctly is a smear, as you well know that "racist" has toxic connotations. Your message that Judaism is intrinsically racist is falsified by the fact that there are Jews of all races, and, within Jewish law, a person's race is irrelevant.

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    7. I have to agree with Brett... Jewish people, race, religion, whatever they want call themselves at the time that most suits there argument, are some of the most racist, self serving individuals I have ever met. As a people they remind me of a guy I knew once that was always blaming his problems on everyone else and thought the world owed him a favour. They cry wolf any nobody listens then they call it racism.... Twisted.

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  4. One more point. Insofar as the opposition to intermarriage is theologically based, branding it racist is highly tendentious. "Racism" is the "unjustified" or "unfair" privileging of someone just because of race. If it's true that God has commanded one to only marry Jews, then that cannot be characterized as "racist" as then obeying God's command is not unjustified or unfair, as God is perfect. If it's false that God has issued such a command, then the believers are mistaken in what they subjectively believe is justified or fair, hence, subjectively speaking, they're not being racist.

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    1. Suppose God told me to kill all Jews. Is that theological, or genocidal? I think it's the latter.

      It doesn't matter what you believe God commands you to do, if you do wrong, you have done wrong. Doing wrong in the name of God is never justifiable, and it is wrong to treat people differently based on their background.

      Also, your example here only accounts for one's personal decisions. I primarily discussed and take particular issue with the collective enforcement of this standard on other people by the community, which you don't even seem to acknowledge.

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    2. The issue is whether or not the community's preference for endogamous marriage among Jews is racist. If they believe it's commanded by God, then the only way you can demonstrate that their beliefs are unjustified or unfair is to show thattheir beliefs were not, in fact, commanded by God. If, in fact, there is no God, and their beliefs are mistaken, they're not subjectively, from their own point of view, acting unjustifiably or unfairly. Also, again, if they accept converts, as many do, your claim is falsified.

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    3. Again, I want to emphasize my total agreement with you about Jews who won't accept converts, just because they're converts. They are indeed racist. But the Jews who do accept converts, can in no way whatsoever, be justly labeled "racist."

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    4. The Jews who do accept converts, do not judge a person by his or her biological ancestry. If they're religious and accept converts, as many do, they judge a person by his or her theological status, and not by race.

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    5. Oh, well, as long as they hate people based on religion, not race. Bigotry is fine, as long as it's not based on race... is that what you're saying?

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    6. My point is that your charge of "racism" is easily refuted. Now if you want to say that Judaism or Jews make a theological distinction between Jews and non-Jews, that's a very banal point. Christianity and Islam make such distinctions between their adherents and non-adherents. Christianity, unlike Judaism, holds that God is just for eternally tormenting people in hell just because they lack faith. And Judaism does not teach that people are to be hated just because they're not Jewish. It is true that some Jews may do this, but you can find in any large group people who teach hatred of outsiders, but it's not a tenet of Judaism. Moreover, the extreme Orthodox that you implicitly hold up as your standard of Judaism, are only a tiny percentage of Jews, so you are distorting things very much.

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    7. I've tried to argue for years "Jewish" people are a religion, not a race, but all I hear from people who are Jewish is I'm wrong. Now, when it doesn't suit you, "Jewish" is just a religion.

      Bullshit.

      If you are going to treat a people as "chosen by God," base it primarily on race, and treat people who are not of that race differently... you're a racist. Get over it. You can dance around it all you want: these practices are racist.

      Unless, of course, there is no Jewish race. Is that the case?

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    8. You seem to think "racism" ceases to be racism when it's based on "theology," but not only can racism and theology co-exist, there is very little racism without theology.

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    9. Being Jewish is, and always has been, both a religion and an ethnicity, (a descendant of the Hebrews.) There exist Jews, and rabbis, of all races. Judaism itself makes a theological distinction between its own adherents and non-adherents, but so does Christianity and Islam. Your attempt to defame Jews is bereft of any factual data. Provide empirical evidence, e.g., research, surveys, hard data, that shows that Jews are more "racist" than Christians or Muslims. You can't, because it's false, and you're just talking, very ignorantly I might add, out of your ass. You made an empirical claim. Provide the data. Put up, or shut up.

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    10. Jews follow a theology of racism, one that is clearly written out in their Holy Books, clear as day, and you try to tell me I lack empirical evidence?

      I have plenty of Jewish people who have commented here and e-mailed me saying they agree with my observation.

      Are you Jewish?

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    11. Jewish theology has nothing to do with race. There are Jews and rabbis of every race. Jewish theology has to do with the people of Israel who, according to the theology, are bound in a covenant with God. People of all races have become part of the Jewish people. You seem to be unable to cognitively process the fact that Judaism has to do with people who are Jews, and being Jewish is not a racial category. It's a religious category that includes people of Jewish descent and converts to Judaism. It's not even possible for Jews to follow a theology of racism, as Judaism is open to all races. I think you're so consumed with hatred that you refuse to face facts. There are black rabbis. Are they racist? By the way, no surprise that you have zero evidence for your stupid thesis. All the sociological data shows that in the U.S., Jews are the least racist of all whites. You have no facts, you can't counter the fact that Jews are of all races, and all you do is smear because you're filled with hatred.

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    12. All the sociological data shows that in the U.S., Jews are the least racist of all whites.

      You just made that up.

      And I happen to know that converts are treated as inferior in Judaism. My wife personally knows many Jews who were treated differently because they were converts and not ethnically Jewish.

      You are the one making things up, and you ought to be ashamed of yourself for claiming I hate Jewish people. You should be embarrassed that you would sink to something so baseless and ignorant. I married into the Jewish community and they rejected me.

      Go fuck yourself, you ignorant racist.

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    13. Still unable to cite any data to support your hatred? Unsurprising.

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    14. I didn't claim to have data, you did (and didn't provide any sources at all, I might add). It's not really my problem that you won't acknowledge the reality of living in the Jewish community.

      Why am I getting e-mails from Jewish people telling me they really connected with what I wrote or sharing their stories of not being accepted as a convert or parents who pressure them into marrying Jewish? I haven't even gotten one negative e-mail, and it's pretty much just you anonymously making up sociological survey results trying to convince me everything I have heard is actually false.

      Pull your head out of your ass. I don't hate Jews, and I don't even hate you. You're ignorant, which is pathetic, not worthy of hate. If I hated Jews, I wouldn't have married one.

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    15. You made a claim on your blog, and of course, could not back it up. That the walking wounded and psychologically scarred of extremist Orthodox Jews who agree with you wrote you is not surprising. You're so ignorant and stupid that you aren't aware that the extremist Orthodox are just an unrepresentative tiny percentage of Jews.

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    16. I explicitly noted that the more religious tend to be the most racist. I agree with your assessment. Why are you so hellbent on being butthurt? If you aren't racist, quit defending racists and racist policies. You'll have to excuse me if I have to base my specific knowledge of what you believe on the few anonymous comments you left here.

      When someone comes rolling in making apologies for racists... how do you suggest I handle it?

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    17. You're a bigot. You cast aspersion on Jews on the basis of a tiny unrepresentative extremist minority. You cast Jewish theology as "racist" when it has nothing at all to do with race, while you ignore the fact that Christian and Islamic theology also draw sharp distinctions between its adherents and non-adherents. You're just a hate-filled ignorant jerk, who incites hatred of Jews by calling them racist, based on your very limited experience with some crazed extremists. You're not just an ignorant piece of work, you're fucking stupid!

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    18. You are a one-trick pony, aren't you? Hate, hate, hate... yes, I hate Jews so much that I object to the way Jews treat other Jews. How hateful of me to point out how the Jewish community at large looks down upon converts and those who are not ethnically Jewish. I should inform all the people who thanked me for writing this that actually, I wasn't speaking out on their behalf as Jews (practicing or former) who experience racism first-hand, but that actually I hate Jews.

      Enjoy your inbred, racist little club, and have fun knowing that people see you for what you really are.

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    19. Stupid ignorant hate-filled asshole wrote "the Jewish community at large looks down upon converts and those who are not ethnically Jewish." Will the moron provide any empirical evidence to back up his smear? Data? Research? Surveys? No, he'll just recount a couple of anecdotes. What a bigoted moron!

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    20. What new bigoted generalization is your limited intellect going to concoct now?

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    21. The anon doth protest too much, methinks.

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    22. The Jew hating author of "What Makes Jews so Racist?" doesn't like being exposed to be the small minded moron who makes sweeping generalizations from his own limited experience, and the experience of his self-hating wife. Moreover, the imbecile thinks that if he gets a bunch of emails from psychologically traumatized refugees of extremist Jews, that that validates his bigotry. What a shithead!

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    23. I can tell I won when all I get in reply is, "You stupid Jew hater!"

      Still no mention of how Jews see nothing wrong with shaming other Jews into marrying Jewish...

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    24. What you got in reply is a challenge: Put up or shut up! Provide evidence for your bigoted assertions. You're so retarded that you think a few anecdotes is evidence! And there's nothing "racist" about a member of a religion wanting other members to obey the religion and marry only other adherents. And what you're low IQ brain can't comprehend, is that it can't be racist, since there are Jews of all races, you idiot! But anyway, you won't provide evidence, because you can't provide evidence, you stupid bigot.

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    25. Again, you proved you cannot read...

      How is it not racist to shame other people into marrying into your race?

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    26. You will never provide any evidence, because you have none. And your pea brain is incapable of understanding this: "there's nothing "racist" about a member of a religion wanting other members to obey the religion and marry only other adherents. And what you're low IQ brain can't comprehend, is that it can't be racist, since there are Jews of all races, you idiot!"

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    27. By the way, you ignorant moron, in the U.S. approximately half of Jews intermarry. So much for your theory of Jewish racism, which you, the stupid idiot that you are, base on some extremist Jews, and even among the extremist Jews their religion officially is anti-racist as a Jew can be of any race. Yes, there are Orthodox black rabbis, but you're too ignorant to know that.

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    28. You switch between Jewish religion and Jewish ethnicity with your claims. Few religious Jews intermarry, so you're ignoring what my post even said.

      I recommend you calm down and actually read my post again. Your comments have devolved into just spouting insults over and over, and it makes you look like a foaming-at-the-mouth crazy person. You stopped addressing what I actually say a long time ago, opting instead to imagine some Jew hater, I guess because it's easier to imagine I hate Jews than that I just observed a horrible thing in your community that needs to be addressed.

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    29. Where's your evidence for your smears, moron?

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    30. By the way, asshole, your smear is entitled "What Makes Jews So Racist?", it's not entitled, "What Makes Some Religious Jews So Racist?" If that's what you meant to say, you should have written it, but then again, you are a numbskull.

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    31. I have to say, you are one of the more amusing living examples of irony I have had the delight of conversing with.

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    32. I amuse myself by deigning to rebut and expose bigoted vermin with limited intellects such as you.

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    33. One more insult, please, I'm about to cum...

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    34. If you really have a Jewish wife, she must be mentally ill to have married you, for firstly, you're bigoted against Jews, and furthermore, you're ignorant and stupid. If you were informed and intelligent, you'd only be obnoxious.

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    35. My wife also has a blog, I link to it in my profile. She was raised Jewish, but she's recovered.

      In fact, a lot of the reason I wrote this post was because I know so many Jewish people, and they have told me that this problem exists.

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    36. You're such a fucking genius, you discovered that there exist some racist religious Jews. And then, the idiot that that you are, is you use this to make a sweeping generalization and smear all Jews. You're just a retarded bigot.

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    37. You obviously did not read my post.

      I’m not saying this stuff to bother anyone, I’m just trying to help. If you aren’t racist, if you have no problem with Jews marrying non-Jews, and if you oppose the oppression of the Palestinian people, then please know I’m not talking about you. I don’t hold a grudge against the Jewish people.

      I can only assume you came here to get angry, not to read what I thought.

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    38. In fact, so far, you have only demonstrated that you read the title.

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    39. Here's what you wrote, you bigoted retard: "What Makes Jews So Racist?" You didn't write "some Jews" or "some religious Jews" or "some Orthodox Jews", just "Jews" implying all, you fucking antisemitic imbecile!

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    40. Yep, you judged a post by it's title...

      Bravo.

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    41. If your wife is fucked up from having bad experiences with extremist Jews, (and she's so fucked up she married a jerk like you), and you and she have had some bad experiences with extremist Jews, what makes you think you're justified in extrapolating from your own individual experiences with extemists to smear an entire group of people, you shithead?!

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    42. Your post shouldn't be "judged" by its title? If the title is inapt, why'd you make it the title, genius?

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    43. Yeah, what would ever make me think that Jews are an angry bunch who think nothing of demonizing outsiders... I mean, besides interacting with such lovely folks as yourself.

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    44. Maybe you should take a break and we can pick this up after sundown tonight.

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    45. If you had any decency, any honor, if you were worth anything, you'd change the title of your post, or add an addendum, and change your post to communicate that you are only talking about some extremist Jews. But since you're a worthless bigot, you won't. Shock me, you piece of shit!

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    46. I changed the title, just for you.

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    47. You really are a fucking Nazi. You're Jewish wife must be really sick.

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    48. Your intellectually and morally bankrupt. You make generalizations about all Jews just based on your experiences with your mentally ill wife from some experiences with a few extremist Jews. Generalizing like that, you are the essence of a bigot.

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    49. Okay, now insult my dog.

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    50. I also borrowed some of your words and improved the title once more. I think it really pops now.

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    51. I'll make you a deal:

      You don't have to apologize for anything you said to me, but you have to apologize for what you've said about my wife and admit there is a problem with racism among strictly religious Jews. If you do that, I'll change my title to, "What Makes Ultra-Religious Jews So Racist?"

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    52. I don't know what you mean by "problem". Define it. What's the percentage of racists among strictly religious Jews as compared to other groups? How are strictly religious Jews more racist than strictly religious Mormons? or Baptists? Muslims? Catholics? Italians? Mexicans? Japanese? You can find racism among virtually any group of people, any religion, nationality, ethnicity, or race.

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    53. So it's not a problem when a Jew is racist?

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    54. You wrote: "there is a problem with racism among strictly religious Jews." You didn't write about an individual Jew, a specific person, you wrote about strictly religious Jews in general. If you claim there is a problem among them, define problem, and explain how racism is more problematic, than racism among other groups of people, since there are racists in any group of people.

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    55. Fucking forget it, you Jewish Supremacist.

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    56. You have no answer to my challenge to you to demonstrate how racism among strictly religious Jews is more problematic than racism among other groups, because you know you have no answer. You single out Jews because you're a fucking Nazi bigot. And marrying a mentally ill Jew doesn't provide you cover for your antisemitism, you asshole.

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    57. You won't even accept a gracious offer on my part after you berated me for... going on 20 comments now. You call my wife mentally ill, you claim I hate Jews repeatedly. You curse...

      Honestly, if I hated you and your people so much... why are you still allowed to comment here? Why don't I delete your comments? I won't, I just have to wonder what justification you can come up with for the fact that I tolerate you.

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    58. Of course, the Nazi has no answer to my challenge.

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    59. I challenge you to read my post, because I don't believe you have.

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    60. I read your post, and just for giggles, I read some of your other posts on your blog. You are a paradigmatic example of a pseudo-intellect. Perhaps you're fortunate insofar as you're too dim-witted to ever truly realize this.

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    61. Alright, I'm sorry. It's just that... well... I was raised to think everyone who wasn't Jewish is out to get us. I'm sorry I assume everyone who disagrees with Judaism is an anti-Semite. I'm sorry I called your wife "mentally-ill," especially in light of the fact that it's me who believes in an invisible guy in the sky. I'm not sorry for calling you those names... you are an asshole.

      But most of all: I admit there is a problem with racism in the Jewish community. I just took it personally, not being racist myself. I'm sorry.

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    62. Okay, a promise is a promise, I'll change the title.

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    63. Ha ha! You're such a slimy, smarmy fuckface!

      --- The REAL Anonymous.

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    64. How do I know it's really you?

      Oh, right, the name-calling.

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  5. I believe a lot of the problem has to do with the intense study on their part of both the Tanakh and the Talmud. Without the New Testament to mute the vile garbage in that book, religious Jews today are taught that not only are the violent killings, racism, slavery, etc. Godly and morally just, but that such things would be continued today if they were given the oppurtunity of power. They even have a holiday and rememberance session yearly about the genicide of the Amelekites, the purpose of which is to fill themeselves of hatred with these people. Rabbis then proceed to call plenty of modern day gentiles "Amelekites" with reckless abandon, tying into these peoples heads that the people around them are disgusting and technically "will be killed out by the time of the Messiah", However, I think the biggest problem is with the men and their study of the Talmud and its commentaries. Principles such as "only Jews should be saved on the Sabbath, but gentiles should be left for deaed bec. God dsoesn't value them enough" gentile seed is like that of animal (from a bible verse) and silly laws among ultra extremists that gentile touched wine, bread and m ilk is forbidden help reinforce this disgusting, "Godly" view of themselves as the chosen people that helps foster such racism.(This only a small and mild subset of the hatred in the Talmud.) Considering you've alredy read both the bible and the Koran I suggest you read the Talmud as well, as there is some pretty sick and crazy shit in there as well. (Your wife probably won't be very familiar with the Talmud, as they avoid teaching it to girls bec. it says equally if not worse stuff about women as it does gentiles.) The problem is thatnot only do these relgious jews look on these sick Talmudic and medieval Rabbis as infallible, but they believe what they say is morally just and should still be followed today, but give it a pass only bec. they afraid of the backlash that otherwise result. Sorry for the long rant, but I have idiot friends that still think this way, so it hits really close to home.

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    1. Thanks Dev, I should pick up the Talmud sometime. Is there any particular translation you think would be best?

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    2. If you really want to see the Talmud as these people are taught it, you should pick up a version known as "ArtScroll" , which can be easily found online. The Talmud has 73 volumes though, but any one of them is guaranteed to have some weird crazy shit in it, so you really can't go wrong. Still, I think the volumes about mariage and divorce are the most compelling, as they cover everything from sex slavery to levirate marriage to the insane bigotry I mentioned earlier.

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    3. 73 volumes? That sounds right up my alley. The more voluminous, the better.

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    4. I actually learned the first book (brachot) for my bat mitzvah- my dad started a weekly shabbas gemarah shiur for a few guys in the area + me when I was about 10 and started with brachot, I stuck around in that shiur on and off until I was around 17 or 18, so I learned quite a bit talmud. :) I was the only woman in the group, and I eventually got driven out by this really douchy friend of my dad who would start mocking me whenever I would say anything. Plus I was getting less and less interested in doing religious stuff at the time (although I stayed in the group long after going OTD)

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  6. The mainstream Jewish reaction to the Holocaust was: take land away from people who weren't involved in it at all (and who as a result have a pretty good reason to be rabidly antisemitic from that point onward) and found a country meant for Jews only, and encourage as many Jews as possible to move there.

    As a piece of strategic thinking, this might have made some sense in the 19th century or earlier, but once nuclear weapons existed, "let's put as many of us as possible into a very small space" is a really, really dumb idea. And having the location of that small space be the source of extra enmity borders on insanity. If there is ever another Hitler -- another national leader who manages to make antisemitism a national policy of a military nation -- Israel will be a huge boon to them, what with the way it will make carrying out their policy so much easier. Even one successful nuclear strike on Israel would be a second Holocaust, and by Israel's own estimates, it wouldn't take more than a handful of successfully-detonated nuclear missiles to wipe out something like half, maybe two thirds, of the world's Jewish population. The only rational way to protect a group in a nuclear world is to have them disperse.

    So when people claim that being the victims of racism has encouraged Jews to be racist, that doesn't surprise me at all. Their reactions to hardship aren't rational elsewhere, why expect it here?

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  7. Jews are racist? Other people aren't? Jews took "land away from people" as "The Vicar" commented. Just another anti-Jewish blog.

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    1. Ah yes, I forgot. That's how most Jewish people write off any criticism of them: "You're just another anti-Semite." No need to actually address that was said, just label them "anti-Jewish" and suddenly you don't have to come to terms with how bigoted Jews can be.

      Newsflash: I married a Jew.

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    2. Just stop it anonymous. All of your comments are just adding more to our ever increasing moral deficit! How will we ever be accepted into the culture of the dirty, dirty gentiles if you keep acting this way?!

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    3. I know plenty of dirty gentiles who accept this kind of isolationism. Most white-supremacists probably really appreciate Jews sticking to their own kind, staying in their own closed communities, even moving off to their own country. Sure, they like how easy that makes it to target Jews with violence, but they accept the practice. Black people fought to end segregation, but Jews fight to stay segregated... and I'm sure fellow non-Jewish racists appreciate it.

      I guess I'm just a dreamer, thinking we can get along... how naive and stupid of me.

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  8. Sure, I can imagine most white supremacists would appreciate having an entire isolated community they can easily find to target, but I also imagine they would love to find an individual Jew walking alone up their block without anyone else to back them up who are easy victims.

    Well, aren't you just a regular John Lennon, but at least you're admitting your positions are naive and stupid. That's a start I suppose.

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    1. Yeah, that's what religious Jews are doing in their closed communities, preventing victimization by backing each other up... like a gang. They aren't just encouraging inbreeding or an irrational fear of outsiders, it's for "protection."

      I would take being seen as stupid and naive over being scared bigots any day.

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  9. My father (jewish) married my mother (catholic) in a latin american country. My father was exiled from the community, my father and grandfather, they never got along, and after grandma died (open minded as she lived the horrors of WWII concentration camps) they never spoke to each other again. Grandma was open minded, and used to say the hasidism and orthodox were beeing racist themselves. She didn´t care what anyone said. She thought her own religion treated women badly. As for us and some other non jewish cousins with jewish father, the community does make you feel like shit. Not worthy. Your mother is called a whore. Your jewish to your catholic friends (rvrn though we are all baptized and gone to catholic school) and your always a gentile to your jewish friends. Yes, these observant jews in this latinamerivan country do look down on you... your a failed cause, the breed of sin. It´s just sad cause you always feel like an outsider. They tell me in the US its different and people convert like nothing and are more open minded. I´ve been to Israel and don´t think those converts would be seen eye to eye or with keen eyes. You can look on the hlaf jewish network stories of 18 year olds beeing treated like second class because of beeing of one jewish parent or so. At the end of the day, it´s like all religions, you should take them lightly or else fundamentalism would bring some crazy shit to a "believers" mind. I say tolerance is my religion... but after hearing half my family is going to hell for not believing in JESUS ,and then never beeing accepted into the other halves "club", I SAY FUCK RELIGION! Note I do believe (or at least want to...) in God, i just think organized religion creates more separation than it does inclusion. Love and respect for all mankind lies in ones heart, and not in some fairytale book full of discrepancies, bigotry, homophobia and so on.. . FUCK RELIGION!

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  10. First, you may want to read this comprehensive study on Jewish attitudes in America. If you jump ahead to page 17, it does say that on almost all measures, Jews are more for integration, equality and intergroup tolerance than non-Jews are.

    http://www.ajc.org/atf/
    cf/{42D75369-D582-4380-8395-D25925B85EAF}
    /JewishDistinctivenessAmerica_TS_April2005.pdf

    Second, your claim about the formation of Israel being the "greatest geopolitical atrocity since WWII" bears no resemblance to reality.

    Please, do some real research into:

    1. The Second Congo War (1998-2003).

    2. The history of Communist China, including the actions in Tibet, the famine that resulted from the failed Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution.

    3. The Rwandan Genocide.

    4. The war in the Balkans in the mid-1990s.

    5. Cambodia during the Viet Nam war and under the Khmer Rouge.

    6. The Second Sudanese Civil War, and the Darfur genocide.

    Third, in response to your "Israel apartheid" claims, I'm wondering if you can tell me:

    - how many Israeli citizens are Arab?
    - how many Saudi citizens are Jewish?
    - how many Arabs are attending universities in Israel?
    - how many Baha'is are attending universities in Iran?
    - how many Palestinians have been granted citizenship in Arab countries other than Jordan, without marrying a citizen of that country?

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    1. Do you know what "geopolitical," as opposed to "national," means?

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    2. Also, like all surveys that ask you how you feel, the results always get darker when reality sets in after the interview is gone. People also say they go to church more often than they do, donate to charity more often than they do... I'm not the least bit shocked that Jewish people will hide their bigotry for a researcher, then go home to their racially segregated enclave and tell their Jewish daughter to marry a nice Jewish doctor.

      Why don't you talk to a black person in the Jewish community and see how [un]welcome they have felt.

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    3. Hey Bret look how Israel is such a symbol of tolerance.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9Y5dcaCyv4&list=PLBE76F9935A603147

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  11. Is there any reason that the results would be any more skewed for Jewish respondents than non-Jewish respondents?

    Voting patterns and support for legislation are also far more quantifiable and objective than speculation over what happens in homes after an interview is done.

    The data confirmed that Jews are more likely to marry Jews. This wasn't something that anyone was trying to hide.

    Why would you assume that I don't talk to people of color in the Jewish community?

    As for the previous question,

    Geopolitics is the relation between politics and territory. Do conflicts somehow cease to count, or to be geopolitical, if we brand them as national?

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    1. The data confirmed that Jews are more likely to marry Jews. This wasn't something that anyone was trying to hide.

      That is one aspect of it, but there are other concerns. I also didn't see any measure of religiosity, which is sort of the entire point of what I wrote (I'm perfectly comfortable acknowledging that less religious or non-religious, ethnically Jewish people are probably less racist than the average person, which may be linked to other factors in their community, like higher rates of education).

      Why would you assume that I don't talk to people of color in the Jewish community?

      I assume you do, otherwise I think it would be pointless to suggest you ask them about this particular issue.

      Geopolitics is the relation between politics and territory. Do conflicts somehow cease to count, or to be geopolitical, if we brand them as national?

      Taking the first example you presented, yes, what has happened in the Congo is worse (I recall reading a story about militia men eating children in front of their parents, for example). Looking at Communism of the Soviet Union (including their mistreatment of Jews) or China (including their military expansions into regions like Tibet), you also some cases of worse abuse. I could go through the whole list, but ultimately, they all have one thing in common: it was neighbors fighting neighbors.

      With Israel, they literally bused in (or more accurately, boated in, and more recently flown in) the "neighbors." While there were isolated pockets of Jewish people in the region prior to WWII, you see in influx of hundreds of thousands after they were fled or were expelled from Europe, and again another wave after WWII and survivors began to immigrate to Israel.

      I see this fallacy that "Oh, they've been fighting for thousands of years" repeated over and over, as a sort of justification of what Israel is doing, but it wasn't like that at all. Jews haven't really ruled Israel since 70 AD, it's not their home anymore, and they took it back by manipulating both the sympathy of good people for their plight and racism among anti-Semites in Europe to justify the violent invasion of tribal people's land. Israel's continued actions are just salts on an otherwise gaping wound.

      It's one thing for a neighbors to still be quarreling, but it's another to go looking for a fight.

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    2. Just to clarify - this particular study didn't deal with the frequency of intermarriage, although it did survey attitudes on legal bans of interracial marriage.

      Data from other studies confirms that there is a preference in the Jewish community for marrying Jewish, although the data also shows that rates of intermarriage are rising.

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    3. The "fighting for thousands of years" part is indeed somewhat of a fallacy. "The Jew is Not My Enemy" by Tarek Fatah provides a good overview.

      The 1948 Arab-Israeli war was very much a case of neighbors fighting neighbors, especially in the phase leading up to May 15, 1948.

      Yes, there was a high level of Jewish immigration to Palestine from the late 1880s onward, initially during Ottoman rule, and later under the British Mandate. A key part of the divergent view of the conflict between Arabs and Israelis is that the Arab view tends to see the immigration ITSELF as an act of aggression, notwithstanding the fact that the Jews were purchasing their land.

      Now, I grew up in a town that was once predominantly white, and now has an Asian majority. The same is true of many other parts of Toronto. Would anyone suggest that I, as a white resident, would have the right to riot until the government halted immigration? Or to attack my Chinese neighbors? Instead, Toronto rightly views its new mutliculturalism as an asset.

      The Peel Commission recommended a 2 state solution in 1937. If it had been accepted, there would have been no Arab-Israeli wars, no Palestinian refugees, and in all likelihood both Arabs and Jews would have benefited economically (just as Toronto has benefited from immigration). It is also possible that the Holocaust could have been avoided, or at least greatly minimized, by giving the Jews a place to flee.

      After WWII, while Jews were languishing in DP camps in Europe, immigration to Palestine was still restricted by the British due to Arab pressure. Finally, in 1947, there was the UN vote to accept the Partition Plan. The Jews accepted it, the Arabs violently rejected it. Again if it had been accepted at that point, there would have been a Palestinian state, no Palestinians would have lost their homes, and there would have been no Palestinian refugees. Instead, the Palestinians chose war, the entire country became the front line, and it was as a result of this war that many Palestinians lost their homes and became stateless.

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  12. Re the surgery and measures of religiosity:

    If you read through the whole thing and look through the data, they do mention comparisons between different Jewish movements.

    What's interesting as well as that relatively liberal attitudes are NOT a sign of assimilation into mainstream American, but rather are a distinctive pattern in the Jewish community. In other words, there is a definite indication that these are seen as communal values within the American Jewish community, and not just general American values. I would argue that current right-wing Orthodox sects do not have a monopoly on religiosity or the interpretation of Jewish values.

    Higher education alone doesn't explain the results. I wouldn't explain, for example, the discrepancy between results for Asians and Jews.

    What we are seeing in certain right-wing Orthodox communities is arguably a RECENT phenomenon of growing fundamentalism, somewhat akin to the way that Santorum now says that JFK's stance on separation of church and state makes him want to throw up. In 1960, it was more obvious to both Jews and Catholics that freedom of religion and separation and church and state was a good thing that would protect them from state-sponsored discrimination.

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    1. Whoops - that should say "survey", not "surgery".

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  13. http://www.youngmoneyhq.com/images/drake-vibe-magazine-cover.jpg

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  14. Every word you have written is 100% accurate. Thank you! Jews will claim they are open-minded, for integration blah blah blah but then they almost always end up marrying Jewish.

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  15. I found this kind of late but I wanted to say that I totally agree with you. I am currently researching this topic to get advice on how to deal with my own situation.

    I am currently dating a Jewish man who I love with all my heart and I treat him very well. I met his Jewish parents and everything seemed fine until one day he told me that his dad hated me because not only am I not Jewish, I'm also black. He told my boyfriend "don't bring that black girl over here."

    So now I am banned from their house. It has put my boyfriend in a tough spot because he has lost respect for some of his family members who have taken to calling him and telling him to break up with me.

    I've done nothing to his family, they simply dislike me because I'm not Jewish. I cannot believe that someone who claims to love their child would put them through something like this.

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  16. THE REAL PROBLEM IS FINDING RACISM AS WRONG

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    1. Right... that's the problem... *face palm*

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  17. In my life experience, which is limited owing to the fact that I am human, and there is only one of me, I have observed several of what appear to be actual conversations by people who express what I would characterise as exclusionary, bigotted, and divisive social attitudes regarding their personal identification as being a member of some particular labelled, presumed-to-exist, social group or other, and who are very quick to overrreact, irrationally, defensively or offensively, to any perceived or actual criticism or threat to that social group as a whole, or to individual members, often conducting their communication in a manner that does them no credit. One of the social groups that many such people who express bigotted attitudes appear to identify with is the social group(s) with the label "Jewish".

    I do not approve of expressing exclusionary, bigotted, and divisive social attitudes based on identification as a member or non-member of particular social groups. Nevertheless, it is sometimes difficult to remember that there could well be many others who identify as members of a social group with the same or similar labels who do not feel the need to publically express their attitudes to membership or non-membership of that presumed-to-exist social group and as such I would rarely have the opportunity to gather evidence that their attitudes to such membership or non-membership are, in fact, not exclusionary, bigotted and divisive social attitudes.

    Other groups that some bigotted people identify with, and associate their bigotry with, include "White people", "Males", "black people", "University graduates", "Australians", "Americans", "Locals", "Christians", "Muslims", "Atheists", "Scientists", "Artists", "Texans", "Conservative voters", "Middle-class", "Private school graduates" and "Manual laborers".

    I do not approve exclusionary, bigotted, and divisive social attitudes based on identification as a member or non-member of any of these social groups, and I have a very poor opinion of people who have them, and an even poorer opinion of those who express them. I have a faint suspicion that it is rarely worth attempting to engage in communication with such individuals. However, I may be wrong. As I am human, I'm not infallible.

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  18. I agree with most of what you said concerning Jewish racism. My wife is Jewish and even within her family there is plenty of racism to go around. For starters, her father's side is Ashkenazi while her mother's is Sephardic. It was a big issue back when they got married.

    I think though that when you examine Israel, there are, racially speaking, many different types of Jews, from the Ashkenazi and Sephardic, to Yemenite, Iranian, Ethiopian and now there are several "Indian" Jews moving in from India. The homogeneity you refer to is mostly in North America and Europe.

    Concerning the Holocaust,sometimes I wonder if the German people were driven over the edge of common sense by the generally atrocious behaviour of the Ultra-Orthodox Jews that inhabited Central Europe. Just look at their behaviour in modern day Israel and you become disgusted with the whole lot.

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  19. You stupid brainwashed cunt .jew scum were not killed in WW2.

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  20. Um just felt like I have to comment and say thank you for speaking your mind and writing this post without reservation! If I were to write down my own thoughts there would be very similar points..

    At the moment, I am typing this comment after being blatantly rejected by my (significant other) who is a (self described) reformist jewish man, whom rejected and dismissed me and our long-term relationship claiming that the two of us have no future together because I am not jewish. I feel confused, hurt but when I think about it, I'm especially offended and insulted, not to mention how sad it makes me that such way of thinking and treating others (bigotry) still exists--it makes me wonder if such jews are capable of feeling affection for other (non-jew) human beings, I believe this thing where i measure one's degree of humanity with their capability for feeling affection for another being. I also wonder if they could ever understand that this behavior is outright racist, cruel, and bigoted. But I hope that it will change. PS. In my city(LA), there's totally a fear of Jewish power and prominence where nobody dares to do any calling out on racism coming from Jews because it is easily labeled as "anti-semitism"--a crime punishable by law. the whole thing is fundamentally ignorant..

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  21. It's funny -- I have heard many, many accounts now from men and woman who have found themselves similarly rejected by Jewish partners and/or partners' families on the grounds that they weren't Jewish, or in some cases, weren't Jewish enough. What's now dawning on me is that I suspect a fair number of these situations involve the heartbroken being fed a line of bullshit.

    In other words, given what I've gleaned about human nature on this ride, I imagine it's actually easier for Jews, in many cases, to say, "Sorry! Religion!" than to admit the reasons for breaking up are more personal -- whether that's out of simple concern for the feelings of the jilted, or as an escape from having to dredge up the deeper, no-fun personal issues we all have in relationships.

    But consciously or unconsciously, rejecting a partner because they're not Jewish is very much like saying, "It's not you, it's me" -- the classic dodge meant to spare feelings. Only in this case, "me" means "God's Chosen" and "you" means "the one God did not Choose," which is especially pathetic and actually quite cruel.

    Oh well. To Bret and all the rest of you who've ever been rejected by a partner or a partner's family, etc., etc. for not being Jewish, or Jewish enough, or for not adhering properly to any theology for that matter, I'm sorry. Hell, I'm sorry for myself; it's happened to me before. And I know it doesn't really help if I say, "Buck up, you're better off," even if that's true, which it is. Love is love, after all. And no matter how comfortably atheist one is, it sure does hurt to be dumped and damned in the same conversation. It's a special kind of wound.




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  22. This is the most important comment you will see:

    ALL Judaism is racist. But since I am a goy and not entitled to demonstrate this rationally to you, let me send you a link from a Jew who gave up some of his ego. I chose this story in particular because this former Jew was never, in fact, religious. That had nothing to do with the racism. It was the simple premise of the thing itself:

    http://www.deiryassin.org/byboard44.html

    Check out my blog.

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  23. Bret Alan,
    I'd like to point out that you won the debate with Anonymous the moment he/she was inclined to repeatedly point out that there are black Jews and Jews from other races. You see, the problem is that a few posts later Anonymous called you anti-Semitic. Do you see the irony here? A black Jew is not a descendant of the Semites. Anon must be only defending the Ashkenazi and the Sephardic Jews. He himself (or She herself) is undoubtedly prejudice because by he/she uses black Jews to defend his/her opinion and then contradicts the statement with an inclusive insult. What a moron!

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  24. I find it awkward that you left out the hamitic curse. So, it is in the babylonian talmud. Blacks are considered cursed. As a matter of fact, the chabad and most religious jewish groups not only believe this, but it is taught in the yeshivahs. If you ask about it at, say, an "ask moses" website (run by the chabad), they will confirm that blacks are cursed, yet they can be redeemed through the 7 noahide laws. So, essentially, if they believe the babylonian talmud is true, then they are technically as racist as the uber religious. This line of thinking also affected Islam's opinion of blacks, as well as mormons, and was also used as one of many excuses to justify slavery.

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  25. I like Jews. They are smart and I many Jewish women are hot. But yeah, a LOT of them are terminally ethnocentric and tribal. They tend to be more tolerant of people who are more 'ethnic' in some way. The tend to really dislike pale blonde types (probably because of they are reminded of the Nazi idea of the Nordic Aryan type as superior - which is somewhat ironic because as someone who grew up in NYC among many Jews, I can tell you right now that many of them have a northern European phenotype).

    I am a blonde haired blue eye Italian. I have had the experience on many occasions of seeing a Jewish person's initially hostile demeanor towards noticeably lighten once they heard my ethnic surname. It is almost as of they are saying "Oy vey! I am sorry - I thought you bus a Nazi! But I see you are an ethnic! My bad! We can talk, I guess!"

    Oy vey indeed...

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  26. dude i completely agree with you. I live in long island great neck and i am surrounded by these aryan like jews. It doesnt make sense until you come here and witness it (specifically the hasidic and safardic). not saying all jews are racist but a good amount of them are, sad to say but even the majority of my jewish friends hate on other races and treat them as if they were of an inferior bloodline. i honestly cant stand it. I'm glad that someone else sees this and not just me.

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    1. CAN I GET AN AMMEEEN. lol

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  27. Omg. What a revealing display of bigotry, racism, anger and ignorance on the part of anonymous - who is such a wuss that he/she is too afraid to put a name to his/her name calling. Hey asshole anonymous: don't cower anonymously. Grow a pair of balls and reveal your pathetic self. I am also a recovering jew. Although my parents tried hard their bullshit indoctrination didn't take. Two of my sisters have married rabbis and my dad moved to Israel to partake in his wet dream after my mother died. I am shunned and disregarded and so are my kids. My children don't know their aunts or cousins due to orthodox Judaism. Anonymous, I do not have to provide you or your fucktard people evidence of racism and bigotry. I FUCKING LIVE IT. Now, I am not ashamed of my views or my opinions so I leave my name. ELISHA PERLMAN?.

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  28. This is a fantastic and well written article. The people who are commenting here for the most part 1) never experienced the hatred from the side of being a Jew who is not racist (despite any claims they might make) and 2) are still in part trying to defend their religious group. Being someone who comes from a Jewish family, parents born in Israel, family in the Holocaust, I can say the majority of the Jewish people my family associates with are entirely racist. That being said, their shuls are extremely racist as well. I'm in an interracial relationship, and although (thankfully) the family members I care most about aren't very opposed, they still won't invite us to certain events where Jewish people who "know" our family will be--you know, God forbid they find out I'm not only dating a non-Jew, but he's not white either :O. Anyway, it disgusts me greatly, and although there is a SMALL majority who are not racist, I can say that most are.

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  29. Look, when it comes down to it, the real issue is about whether an individual has been open and honest with the individual he/she is dating. Everyone has beliefs. Some believe in a God but do not prescribe to religion; some follow a specific religion; some are agnostic; and others are atheist. All of these perspectives deserve respect. As Thomas Jefferson said, "[I]t does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." It makes sense that people with any one of these beliefs may want to hold true to that belief and maintain those traditions within their families. All of that is fine. And frankly, I don't think it's right to hold that against anyone. What is problematic is when someone dates someone that doesn't have the same beliefs and then, wouldn't you know it, a year or two down the road decides they can't be with that person because they're not the "right" religion. If a Jew wants to marry a Jew and only a Jew, so be it. But he/she shouldn't run around wasting everyone else's time in the process. That IS wrong.

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  30. I'm a convert. Not born Jewish. Not ethnically Jewish. Not racially Jewish. Some Jews will treat me badly on account of that. They are in the wrong. But I still want to marry Jewish because it is a tenant of the faith I chose. Ideally I would like a nice nerdy Scottish Jew, but I would happily marry a black Jew, or an Indian Jew or any other sort of Jew. Christians are also commanded to marry only other Christians, Catholics to marry other Catholics, Orthodox marry Orthodox. Muslims (the men) are permitted to marry Jews, Christians and Sabeans but not pagans.
    I can't find a Jew to marry because most of them marry out. In the process my chosen faith is being diminished numerically (most of their children don't identify Jewish) culturally (they have Christmas trees and syncretic beliefs) and intellectually (most don't understand the basics of their religion).
    The fact that you think my desire to see what I find valuable preserved into the future racist is pretty typical of the sort of intellectual colonialism that passes for deep thought in LeftLiberal circles. You want YOUR liberal/pluralist way of life to not only survive, but to spread at the expense of my traditionalist one. Traditionalist communities don't demand that you become like us, but you demand that we become like you and accept your value system. There is nothing more condescendingly racist than middle-class, educated, liberal, western whites telling the rest of the world how it needs to think and behave, and then swearing at people and calling them racists when they resist your attempts at acculturation. Thank you for your attempts to bring your more enlightened "civilization" to the natives, but no thanks. I chose to leave the bat-shit crazy of the so-called anti-racist but strangely race obsessed Left a long time ago. The "racism" of Jews and other traditional groups I can handle, it's got nothing on the racism of the Left.

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  31. Separation based on religion is just as ridiculous as separation based ob race. Difference is, races are a relaity...where as religion is system artfully and effectively designed to keep people living in fear of what happens after you die. I'm just glad I count myself among those that aren't members of any of these so called "religions" and that I choose to live my life without the shackles of fear binding me.

    I know this thread isn't about the idiocy of religion....but my statement isn't just about that. It's about how much it saddens me to see people so blind that they would persecute their own family for pursuing love outside of their circle of belief, among other things. Racism is racism. Call it different all you want.

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  32. This is a great thread. I am a Catholic and have been in a relationship with an Orthodox Jew for a year. He finally decided he was ready to face the embarrasment of telling his family he was in a relationship with a gentile. His community does not accept converts and he was been forbidden to see me. I am not welcome in their home and they have made it clear he will no longer be welcome either if he continues. He has ended the relationship stating god will never forgive him for loving me, and that I will never understand why this must be. I have never felt so much discrimination and hurt. Call it what you want, but when you are on the receiving end of the stick, a bigot is a bigot and a racist is a racist. It doesn't matter what the background is. Hate breeds hate, regardless of its purpose.

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  33. Very interesting discussion here.
    My view is that most religions have a vocal minority of fundamentalists preaching rules to their brethren which prohibit individual choice - and that's just wrong.
    People have the ability & duty to push back on such beliefs. Religious person or not, bigotry is wrong & you cannot hide behind some religious 'belief' to justify it.
    Unfortunately the Jewish faith appears more stubborn to change - the Catholic Church, from my experience, was rather similar but has to 'evolve'.
    We are "all equal but unique"...

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  34. B.D.S.!!!!!!!!!! Boycott war criminal Israel!!!!!!!!

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  35. orthodox Jews are bigots .that is a given they of the goy /Christians
    as farm animals here to serve Them as gods chosen people
    a Christian so my belief system in Christ is to forgive them
    aka bigoted Jews and pray for their salvation.

    ReplyDelete
  36. orthodox Jews are bigots .that is a given they of the goy /Christians
    as farm animals here to serve Them as gods chosen people
    a Christian so my belief system in Christ is to forgive them
    aka bigoted Jews and pray for their salvation.

    ReplyDelete

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